Kevin English: [00:00:00] Hello. My guest today is Michael Cohen. Michael is a 63 year old, former weightlifting Olympian, and two time Olympic head coach. In addition to Olympians, Michael has coached numerous senior, junior and youth national champions today.

Michael specializes in all things, strength and has programs for all levels and all ages. Michael, welcome to the show. Yeah. Thanks for coming on. Really appreciate having you here now. You're a weightlifting Olympian and a lot of my audience or some of my audience may not know what that means. Can you tell us - what is weightlifting?

Michael Cohen: [00:00:34] Sure weightlifting is one of the oldest sports in the Olympics, it was in the very first Olympics, the modern Olympics 1896 and it's morphed over the years. Basically, there are two competitive lifts. The first one goes from the floor all the way overhead in one motion is the fastest movement in the Olympics.

Average speed, about two tenths of a second to complete. That's called the snatch. And the second one is the most difficult one, it's the clean and jerk. You can lift the most weight. The bar goes from the floor up to the chest. You take a couple of breaths and you heave it over your head and because you get to stop, you can lift a lot more weight.

They take the best snatch and your best clean and jerk. Put them together for a total. Whoever's got the best total wins,

Kevin English: [00:01:13] Gotcha. So whoever we can lift the most weight is going to be the winner. And that's a weight class sport. Is that correct?

Michael Cohen: [00:01:19] correct. There're 10 weight classes for men, 10 weight classes for women.

In fact, what we're seeing now, is there more registered female weightlifters than male lifters

Kevin English: [00:01:28] Okay. Are you with the so far? Basically Olympic weightlifting consist of only two lifts, the snatch and the clean and jerk. Not to be confused with the more generic term weightlifting, you know, things like bench presses, bicep, curls, things like that. So I asked Michael how he got started weightlifting.

 

Michael Cohen: [00:01:46] I got into it naturally, my father was a member of our national and international squad. He owned a gym in Savannah  in the fifties that went all the way up to the two thousands. And I was born in the gym. I was a gym rat and I've got old videos, super eight movies of me lifting weights when I was in the crib one, two, three, four year olds.

My first competition when I was seven. And , I've been involved ever since. So I grew up in the weight room enjoyed the sport. Daddy was a world-class weightlifter. He had an accident, a freak accident, in the gym and broke one of his vertebrae and his upper back that put him out of the Olympic level.

And so I took over to mantle as far as lifting. Now, he's still training now he's 88 and in phenomenal shape. But  I stayed with the sport and as I grew, I got bigger and a little bit better and before you know, it, I made the Olympic team and traveled all over the world on our national squads and international squats and had a very, very long career as an Olympic weightlifter.

Kevin English: [00:02:45] And I'm guessing dad was probably your coach then as a young man, is that right?

Michael Cohen: [00:02:48] My father was my coach and still is my coach. He s' in the gym now, four or five days a week, you'd see three generations train at the same time. My father, myself and my sons and my wife. So it's a little bit of a family affair and he is still the master. He's still the guru of the sport and not quite as quick as he was, but he is real quick there to tell me I'm messing up.

Kevin English: [00:03:12] All right, so that's fantastic. So 88 year old father is still your coach and can point out some tactical things, et cetera. Now, is he still performing Olympic lifts?

Michael Cohen: [00:03:21] He still competes, competes in the national championships in masters, which is weightlifting for over 35. There are different age groups, different weight classes for that as well. And so he is probably if not the most decorated master weightlifter in the country, if not world and at 88 still competes, he's usually the oldest in the competition.

He does very, very well. You know, he, he trains in this facility, which is the Anderson Cohen weight lifting center three days a week. He doesn't miss it.

Kevin English: [00:03:49] I love it. 88 years old, still competes and still works out three times a week. By the way those banging sounds you hear in the background, that's the sound of people getting stronger. I asked Michael how he made the Olympic team.

Michael Cohen: [00:04:03] Well, at that time in the eighties, it was the Olympic trials. Our Olympic trials were held in the spectrum of Philadelphia. I was lifting in the 181 pounds plus 82 kilos. And at that competition you know, whoever wins is going to make the team for sure, whoever comes with second is more likely going to make the team based on the production of the other classes below you.

The way classes below me did not produce the results. So they made an announcement that the top two and the 82, five kilos or eight one pound less would make the Olympic team. I went there as a top five athlete. I did very, very well in the snatch, which is what I was known for and the cleaner jerk I opened with what I needed to make the team.

You get three attempts. That's all you get is three attempts. So when I, my first attempt and I missed it, and then I went on my second attempt and missed it. And as I was walking up to chalk my hands up, I can hear my father say, this is it. You better do it. And so I went up there and made the lift. And at that point in time, I knew I made the Olympic team.

And then the next day they made the final decision where they were the board of directors of USA w get together and actually vote. And it's just a formality, but you're not, it's not done until they say it's done. And I was named the Olympia Olympia in 1980.

Kevin English: [00:05:15] Wow, what an accomplishment. I can imagine that that had to be really intense as you're going in there for a third lift. Now, is this a competition where when you open with a lift,  can you go backwards in weight?

Michael Cohen: [00:05:29] Once you call the weight that's it. And you know, a lot of athletes would take a lighter weight just to get one in, but we weren't there just to get one. And we were there to make the team. That was, it was gonna be an all or nothing.

Kevin English: [00:05:39] Gotcha. So it's an all or nothing. So that's, that's why you failed the first two attempts. They weren't your normal openers, right?

Michael Cohen: [00:05:44] More than I've done before. It was not like I was opening with a weight I'd done before.  This is more than I've ever tried before in competition. And my father said that the only shot you have of doing it is having three shots and giving it everything you got cause anything will happen. If you know, you're going to miss it.

It's more than likely not going to be strength, it's gonna be a technical flaw. It's like gymnastics with weights. And so the first two, I just was thinking about everything but what I need to be thinking about, and the third one, I calmed down and relaxed, even though there's more pressure on you.

And I was able to pull it off, make  both to clean and the jerk.

Kevin English: [00:06:16] Okay. So before we continue our story, you'll need a little background. The 1980 summer Olympics were held in Moscow. And some of you may be thinking right about now, wait a minute. Wasn't that the year we boycotted the Olympics. Yup. It certainly was. If you remember back then, president Jimmy Carter told Russia if they didn't pull out of Afghanistan, which they'd invaded the year before, we wouldn't send any athletes to the Olympics.

And we didn't. The United States, along with 64 other countries, boycotted the 1980 summer Olympics. Here's Michael's take.

Michael Cohen: [00:06:50] Yeah.  Basically boils down to his, as he told the Russians, if the don't remove themselves from Afghanistan, that we would not send our Olympic team to Moscow. Now you have to understand the politics what's going on. First of all, you can't bluff  the Russians at that time. It's a different world now, but back then, and so the Russians could not possibly cave in to Jimmy Carter.

A peanut farmer from Georgia, there was no way that they can afford that internationally. That said it ended up being a, a disaster for Olympic athletes like myself, because you got to understand back then in the eighties, there was no money in the sport. You didn't get paid for this. The athletes today are all professional athletes and I'll get paid.

They get paid huge sums of money. But the reality of the matter is back then you did it for the glory. That was it. And so the decision was made that the athletes would not go. And as it turns out, looking back on it historically, it was a big deal. Forget about the athletes part of it. You've got to understand that the Soviet union was a dire straights of capital money and they needed something that, that United States was going to give them.

And that's millions of dollars in cash to compete in the Olympics now with that, but you've got all the thousands of Americans that would have traveled to the Soviet union - hotel, food and whatnot. It was a financial gamble for them and they did not get it. And I really believe today looking back over it, that that was one, one of the many factors that led to the downfall  of the old Russia.

Is is the fact that they didn't get that cash flow that, that millions, if not billions of dollars, hard currency that they so desperately needed. So maybe Carter had it right along the wall. It matters to the athletes like myself, but that was it, you know, and a lot of my teammates and athletes on the Olympic team, that was a one-shot deal.

You only make it once in a lifetime. And that's it. When you got to understand, again, it's not a job,  everything you have is on hold - your life, your career. Everything. And, you know, can you stick around eight more years? Most of the time, the answer's no, nowadays it's profession. And so you stick around because you're getting paid, but back then it wasn't.

So it was, it was a tough time, a bitter pill to swallow.

Kevin English: [00:09:02] Yeah, it certainly sounds like it. There were obviously big things at play things that were completely outside of your control.

Michael Cohen: [00:09:08] As my father said, when he got me ready for the competition you know, you do what you gotta do to make the team. You can't control what's going to happen outside United States, outside the world. You can't control that, but you can't control putting himself on the team. And that's the goal.

The family needs that to, to solidify the deal. My father was, he was geared for the 56 Olympics until the injury. This was an opportunity to put us back in the fold.

Kevin English: [00:09:32] So you had, you have this once in a lifetime shot to actually go and perform at the Olympics and unfortunately, due to circumstances completely outside of your control,  but just emotionally, how do you, how do you deal with the aftermath of that?

Michael Cohen: [00:09:46] Well, I will tell you a lot of my peers, it was life-changing for a lot of reasons. The reality of the matter is you set your guidelines, you set your goals. And every athlete, every professional is a goal oriented person and you set those. And of course that goal you will not achieve at this particular time.

And so I said, you know, I'm plenty young enough. It's an old man sport. I can certainly come back again and again and again. And of course, unfortunately injuries stopped me in, in that we proceed on, but that that's just the way it is. It's you can't cry over spilled milk. It's done. It's out of your hands.

You did what you need to do to be ready and be set. Once you're named Olympian you're Olympian for life. And that's a cool deal. So, you know, I never looked back. I kept moving forward, even when I decided to retire my career. I, wasn't gonna look back and cry over it.

Kevin English: [00:10:35] Wow. I can't begin to imagine. To be so young, Michael would have been what, 21 at the time. And to achieve the dream of becoming an Olympic athlete and traveling to Moscow to compete. Only to have all that dash by world politics. But that's by no means where Michael's story ends. In fact, it's just the beginning.

Michael went on to successfully compete on the world stage.

Michael Cohen: [00:10:59] The Olympics was obviously the highlight. That would be what you hear people talk about was the Olympics, but I had some very big competitions that were incredibly important. I was able to compete in China in 1980 when it was a closed society. And again, Carter had it set up where we go to China to compete in Shanghai, that would have been the first Olympics that China was allowed to compete in the 1980 Olympics.

And of course they boycotted it with us. It was a great opportunity. I got to compete there. In front of 30,000 people and uh,  just like Olympic trials sent out with a do or die lift. You make the lift, you win the gold medal, you missed the lift, you come in second . And I went out there and made the lift and won the gold medal in China.

And so that was a you know, as far as an athletic point of view, that was probably the, the utopia of, of Mike, the pinnacle of Michael Cohen. But I was able to compete all over the world and and enjoy that level of competition for a very long time. Yeah,

Kevin English: [00:11:50] And are you still competing today?

Michael Cohen: [00:11:52] I play today. I train, I compete in the masters division, which is over 35 in different age groups. And I, I still compete. I enjoy the thrill of competing. I can't lift the weights I did, obviously those days are long gone, but I enjoy pushing myself to see what I can accomplish. I'm not trying to relive my youth.

I'm just trying  to stay healthy now. And uh,  the most important thing is to have fun. And so it's, the pressure is gone. It's not about that. It's about just having a good time.

Kevin English: [00:12:22] That's fantastic.  We had already mentioned that your whole family is still active and lifting. You've mentioned your sons, your father, your wife is also an accomplished lifter, but it sounds like for the most part  you've transitioned into the coaching hat, right? You wear that more than the competitor hat, it sounds like tell us, we know that we'd read it in

the intro that you were a two time Olympian coach. Talk us through that story. How did that come about?

Michael Cohen: [00:12:47] When I, I got injured in the 88 Olympic trials and it prevented me from making the team. I hate to use the word shoe-in, but I was a shoe-in and I got injured backstage. In between the snatch and clean and jerk I got hurt.  A freak accident that would never hurt you more than a couple of days.

And that was it. One shot. That was it. And so I was backstage after it's all said and done. I was very upset. My father came over and said, son, it's time  to move on. You know, your body is tearing down. Now you're getting older. You need to think about other things he says. I said, well, that's it.

Then I'll be done. I'm not going to get involved anymore. He said, no, that's ridiculous. You, you got all this knowledge and expertise. You've been there as an athlete. Why don't you go into coaching? And so reluctantly I followed his advice and as it turns out, it was a very smart move. He saw something in me that I didn't see, and I have been  I started a program in Savannah.

That program grew into a powerhouse in 19 95. The international lifting Federation and the international Olympic committee made a decision that women would beallowed in the Olympics in 2000. And I was poised. I had several athletes, female athletes that were geared towards that Olympic team.

And in 98, I was named the Olympic coach of the year in 99. And then I was named the Olympic coach. And so I got to do something that no other Olympian has been able to do. And that is in weightlifting is,  to be the Olympic coach and be the Olympic athlete and do all at one time. And so I was able to go to Sydney with my team.

I was very fortunate to have one of our young ladies win a gold medal, and one of our young ladies win a bronze medal. So it was a very rewarding experience.

Kevin English: [00:14:25] Wow.  And that would have been the first time that women were in the Olympics for weightlifting.

Michael Cohen: [00:14:31] Yeah. Yeah.

Kevin English: [00:14:32] But you had the gold and the bronze medalist.

Michael Cohen: [00:14:35] Yeah. We had the gold and bronze medals for the United States team and it was obviously a phenomenal feeling to be able to accomplish that as a coach and ended to be selected to go again, which is very unusual. That's usually something's not done , to go back and Athens in 2004,

 

Kevin English: [00:14:51] So Michael finally did get to go to the Olympics. But this time as the head coach for the women's weightlifting team in Sydney, Australia. And then again in 2004, that time in Greece. In 2000, his women brought home the gold and the bronze. In 2004, has women were battling some injuries, but still competed as best they could.

Since we'd mentioned injuries a few times in this story so far, this seemed like the perfect place to ask Michael about the safety of weightlifting. As most of you listeners know if you perform any athletic endeavor long enough, you're going to come up against injury. And the further you push towards becoming elite in any sport, the more likely you are to become injured.

So this seemed as good a place as any to address the safety of performing the Olympic lips. I mean, there's no way us non elite mere mortals should be performing these lifts. Right?

 

Michael Cohen: [00:15:42] Well, first of all, you got to understand for every doctor that you could pull up and say, you should not squat, deadlift or do Olympic movements. You've got an equal number on the other end of the spectrum. And that's something that's always amazed me.  It's not a white or black issue as in it's this way or this way that you you've got to understand that everybody's different.

Everybody's different training. An older athlete is different and train a younger athlete. No question about that. But you know, older athletes like myself, it takes a little longer to recover. We got more aches and pains. I mean,  it's a whole different kettle of fish, but. Medical staff that I deal with are cutting edge and they understand that the best way to extend life, the best way to have a healthier life is to work your muscles.

When you stop working your muscles and you start becoming more sedentary then you have all kinds of health issues down the road, stay happy. My father is 88. He doesn't miss a workout. He's 88 years old. He still comes to the gym and trains doesn't train like his son, me or his grandson, but he's working out.

He's messing with the weights, progressive resistance strengthens the bones, strengthens the joints, gives him the power to do things that people his age. Let me tell you, we have a program in here called the get excited and move, which is dealing with older groups of individuals. They will be in the gym training, a group setting.

20, 30, 40 of them. At one time, my father will come and set up his little platform, do his lifting. And when he gets finished, puts everything back, jumps on the floor,  does 15, 20, 30, 50 pushups, like rapid fire at 88 in front of all those people that are certainly nowhere near his age. And he just blast it out and they all look at him like, Oh my God.

And then the reality is to him, that's insignificant. That's nothing. He has prepared herself so hard. Yeah, he's going to have aches and pains, but it's nothing like his peers.

Kevin English: [00:17:33] Yeah, that's a great story. I think that when most people think of an 88 year old person, they're not envisioning somebody doing Olympic lifts, they're not envisioning somebody knocking out, you know, repping out push ups. They're probably thinking of somebody frail, probably, in a home, et cetera.

This progressive overload and this resistance training is not only building muscle, but it's also building healthier joints, healthier bones, all of which are things that are key to independence.

Michael Cohen: [00:18:01] Yeah. Everything people don't understand is that you have to do resistance training. Now I'm not talking about bodybuilding at an elite level in the weight room that that's  no, I don't even train like that for Christ sake. But the reality of the matter is, is you got to put your body against resistance if you want it to respond.

And my workouts are 40 minutes, 45 minutes, maybe an hour every once in a while. My father's maybe 30 minutes. It's intense. It's very high intensity, but it's very, very quick and it's done and he's got his heart going good. His muscles are in great shape. His agility, his mind, all those things.

The most impressive thing my father does in front of his people. The people that I have a gym is not do the pushups,it's that he jumps down on the floor, does them, and then jumps back up. It doesn't take him, you know, 30, 40 seconds to get down 30, 40 seconds to get back up. It is bam. Bam done like a child.

And that's the advantage of having your muscles stronger than the average person to do things down the road, you do cardio to live longer. You do strength trading to have a higher quality of life. And so when you combine those two, you cannot only live the right age, but you can do things. And that's what my father lives for, is doing things.

And he's instilled that in me as well. Okay.

Kevin English: [00:19:20] I've heard somebody else refer to that same thing as you, you know, we all have a lifespan and we all have a health span as well. Right. And that degree of attention to your health specifically in this case, the resistance training and the cardio and nutrition and all of that tied together holistically, it's gonna determie whether or not you're going to age healthy or unhealthy.

So, yeah, hats off that's. That's fantastic. I love to hear that,  your father 88 years old, and it's still

Michael Cohen: [00:19:53] Time and time again, it, there's no reason to live to 85, 90, a hundred, whatever it is, if you are not able to do things and enjoy life. My father is 88. He enjoys life and that's what it's all about. So you have the power and strength to do to things that other people, your peers look at and go my God, how, and the reason is he's done it all his life.

And so it's a, it's a, life-changing like anything that we deal with health, nutrition, exercise, it's got to be a life deal. You got to do it the entire time. If you want to get the benefits and everybody wants to benefit, but very few of us are willing to pay the price to get those benefits.

Kevin English: [00:20:29] Yeah. That's well said. So that health rent is due every

day, every week. Right? It's not something that you can of, you know, we're recording this in January and a lot of folks are in gym right now,  and but there's a lot of new year's resolutioners that are making resolutions to get healthy right now.

And unfortunately the majority of them are going to drop out in the next month or

two. But as opposed to making, working out something that you have to do or something that you do for a certain amount of time to get back in shape or et cetera, I think that those of us that , weave it into a part of our lifestyle, right,

that it's something that we do every day. And that's just how we live. That's the stronger way to age.

Michael Cohen: [00:21:12] Yes, if you want. And I hear it all the time. Cause I deal with a variety of people in our facility and the older generation, but not necessarily my generation, but the older generation than me. You know, they, they look at people that are successful in doing things and they go, God, I wish I could do that. No, no, there's no wishing.

It's very, very simple deal. It just requires a lot of dedication. Is that what you want to do? And of course, like you said, new year's Eve resolution is, you know, I'm going to get in shape. Look here, it took you a lot longer to two or three months to get the way you are. Now. It's going to take a lot longer to get you out of that position.

And so it's got to be a life-changing situation and those who make that decision, regardless of when they start live a much, much happier lifestyle, because they can do things. And that's where it's all about us doing things

People who train can do things. That's what you want to be able to do.

Kevin English: [00:22:06] Did you catch that last sentence? Michael said people who train can do things. That's what you want to be able to do. That's very succinctly spoken people, especially those of us over 50 who strength train regularly are stronger. Fitter. Healthier and are more capable. Competent and confident and this spills over into all other areas of our lives.

As you can certainly tell by now, Michael is very grounded. You might call him old school. I asked him about his coaching style since he coaches, kids, elite athletes, older adults, and even some special populations. And here's what he had to say.

Michael Cohen: [00:22:46] My coaching philosophy is, is old world old school. If you would. And  the older athletes train very, very difficult, very, very hard, but they train smart. And the new philosophy of, I see of other coaches coming up, not necessarily my peers, but younger than me, is that they spend a tremendous amount of time doing a lot of remedial stuff that really doesn't pay dividends.

It's not doing you any good. And it aggravates me because it's a very simple deal to train elite level athletes in any sport. You find out what you need and you gear towards that. My peers were old school was me. They believed in pushing hard and train hard, but it's a philosophy you train hard, but you rest harder.

That's the secret. Okay. You can't go, go, go, go, go. Because you gonna tear up, tear up, tear up, you know, if you've got 50, 60, 70,000 superstars, then you don't mind pushing real hard. If you hurt one and you got another one could come up and take their place. We do that a professional sports in the United States.

We're very good at it. But if you've only got one or two superstars, then you can't do that. You've got to, you gotta really baby and take time and nurture it and care for it. There's an old saying down here in the South, and that is, is you don't fiddle on a Stradivarius. And that means that you can't beat up something that's really, really priceless.

And that's my philosophy is I take my time. I look at the whole athlete, a holistic athlete, and I'm pretty good at motivating somebody to get them to go to where they'd never been before and, and push them, but push them with, with common sense. If an athlete tells me they're injured, that's it, it's done.

I wait until they get cleared by medical. Before we started moving any further than that, I am not someone who's gonna push you to the nth degree. But then on the other hand, I know what it takes to get to the elite level. I know exactly what you have to do. Definition of an athlete is one that can endure pain.

The definition of a champion is one that can endure a lot of pain. And so there's going to be some of that in there. Now that philosophy worked real well with Olympic level athletes. Up and coming athletes. Not for master athletes, not for older athletes. That's a whole different ball game.

So you gotta be able to switch your gears when you're dealing with youth, it's a slow motion. That's technique, technique techniques. When you deal with older athletes junior athletes, you know, sub twenties into the 20 fives and so forth, different ball game, you go at it and give it everything you got because you only got a small window of opportunity to be successful.

And then after that master athletes have fun, be safe. And stay in shape and, and, and that's it. Those three different groups get three different levels of Michael Cohen.

Kevin English: [00:25:26] Okay. Yeah. Let's, let's pick that apart a little bit. Cause you said a lot there. So obviously we all know, we remember when we were younger, recovery is not , what do you need to worry about recovery? Right? You just do it when you're younger. You said that you said train hard, but rest harder.

Let's talk about the masters athletes that come in and they want to perform well, they want to be athletes, but not maybe at a national or international level.  How do you get them to perform at their best and get the most out of them? And what do you, how do you coach them on the recovery piece?

Michael Cohen: [00:25:58] the first thing you have to understand is the coach cannot want it more than athlete. It's just that simple. The first thing I do is I sit down in the same office with the, with the kids, the master athletes, whatever it is, and we talk about their goals, what they want to accomplish, and then  what can I do to help them accomplish their goals?

And that will tell me what we're dealing with. And if we're dealing with somebody who's very, very focused and they've got a set up - coach, I want to be a member of the 2028 Olympic team. Okay, well, that tells me pretty much where the, where the train of thought is. And a master athletes is I want to compete in the world championships and next year and do top five in the world, if I can, that's a different level altogether, different game.

And so the first thing is I find that out and I match that goal to what they need to be successful. That level a master athlete that comes in here, he just wants to work out to get a little stronger, different ball game altogether. They're not interested in competing. They're not interested in the Olympics to worlds or anything like that stuff.

So therefore their training philosophy is totally different, totally different, you know, much more holistic because they're not interested in focusing that beam of light into a small little laser. Okay, that laser is that goal they're looking for. What's my goal to be healthier so I can, I can enjoy life.

That's a big spectrum. We can do a big spectrum training. The more focused you get, the more zeroed in you get, the more laser you get in there. The more specific the training is, the more it's gotta be exactly right. What we need to get you to that level. And so my job is to take all that and put it all together and match it up and then put out the program.

But I tell the athletes time and time again, I can't want it more than you. Right. If you want to be a member of the 2028 Olympic team in weightlifting and compete in Los Angeles, then you will have to make some sacrifices. I mean, it's just that simple. So you can't call me at three o'clock in the afternoon and say, you know, I'm supposed to be in at 3:30 coach, but I can't make it you know, something's come up.

That can't happen. So you're not focused in on what you need to do. And so those kinds of things dictate the type of coach I will be. And if, if you're going to give it everything, I'm going to give it everything to the nth degree. And so that's how it works out. So, mutual respect of each other.

Kevin English: [00:28:06] Yeah. And I can see how that works. And so for folks that are just coming off the street, it sounds like you coach a wide variety of athletes, right? Obviously you coach the elite of the elite,

so  what is the typical person coming in? Who's not looking for something, a leap, but is looking for something more, just, you know I want to be in shape on a move, better, want to feel better. What does that person's profile? I'm trying to think , how do they find you and what are they looking for?

Michael Cohen: [00:28:32] What they're looking for is they're looking for answers. That's what they're looking for. They're looking for you to guide them and give them the answer they need and to match up what they're looking for. I've got individuals that come in here that they're looking just to gain a few pounds, lose a few pounds you know, and getting better.

I've had a couple of knee surgeries. I had hip operation. I can't do the things I used to do. I want to be able to do those things again. I want to be able to hit the ball further in golf. You know, I want to be able to go out and take a run and not be breathing really hard, you know, those types of things.

, but the average person that comes into the Anderson corner Olympic training center is looking to be better at something else they're doing.

That's the average. And then I've got a large group of people. Like we talked a minute ago about the gym program, get excited to move, that have mobility issues, serious mobility issues central tremors. Parkinson's Ms. Lewy body dementia. Those individuals have concerns where their biggest fear in life is falling because they, if they're falling or hurt something or break something, Are not going to be able to get them.

The wife's not gonna be able to get 'em up. They gotta call somebody to help him come over there. That's a huge fear. And then just basically wants to, to build up more muscle mass, good, more bone density so they can protect himself when they fall and to improve their balance.

That's a totally different ball game. I mean, you know, we're talking about balancing and just life skills and those kinds of things, so that all has to be matched. So when you talk about coaching, there's a different philosophy that matches the different type of group of people we're using. There's not atypical in our facility.

And then the last is the ones that are trying to lose weight. I mean, that's, you know, that's the bugaboo, everybody to country has gained 15, 20 pounds from all those things just happened, locked us up in, and everybody's trying to get rid of that because one of the the horrible things about what's going on is the fact that this pandemic we're in affects people that have too much weight on their body.

It causes too much strain on her heart, in the lungs. And so therefore more people are now looking at dropping the weight and getting it down. It's just, it's difficult to start. You know, you gain 20 pounds. It took nine months and it ain't gonna take, you know, three weeks to get it down.

Kevin English: [00:30:40] Yeah, that's right. That's right. And so when these people are coming to you, what, what kind of modalities do you do you use? I mean, does everybody clean and jerk and

snatch, or

Michael Cohen: [00:30:53] are going to be your Olympic lifters, weightlifters power cleans virtually every sport that I've worked with has power cleans in their workout because it's a great overall if you're involved in movement at all, that is a great movement to use. So, you know, obviously squats of some kind.  Dead lifts of some kind, pulls of some kind, some upper body work obviously core, which is your stomach and back.

A lot of that, regardless of sport if you're dealing with explosive sports, then agility and speed and reaction, that that becomes very, very critical. This morning we had the university had their football team in here all 100 plus athletes come in here, two sessions, they train here. And so we have the facility that can house that many athletes, clearly they're training different than the program that walked into the gym 40 minutes after they left, which is where your Parkinson's essential tremor.

So we went from a much high level of intensity training to a much lower level intensity training, but more time on balance and coordination and whatnot.

Kevin English: [00:31:54] Yeah. Yeah. Obviously I love the way that you match programs to populations. And so you'd call it your get excited and move program. And that's the special population Parkinson's et cetera. What drew you to that?

Michael Cohen: [00:32:08] I was hired by the national wheelchair basketball association in 2013 to prepare the team for 2016 in Rio. And, and my job was to get them ready and,  for them to have the first strength coach they've ever had. And the reality of the matter is in 2012, the team male or female in the Olympics did not do very well.

And so the Olympic committee said, you've got to hire somebody. So my name was drawn out of a hat. And no, I was, I was hired because I'd worked with Paralympics before. So I wrote, designed a strength conditioning program for our wheelchair teams, both men and women. And we started out with, with 96 plus athletes and we whittled it down to the 15, when I was at the Olympic training center i n 2016, about three months before the games, they were making their final selection of the men's team and making a final selection.

And while I was out there,  the Parkinson's support group in Georgia got in touch with my wife who got in touch with me at the training center, said these people would like to talk to you. So I called them up and they said, look here, we would love you to help design a program to help our group of people.

And I said, well, I don't know a whole lot about Parkinson's or essential tremors. I know it's a neurological disease, but that's about it to limit to my knowledge. Let me do some background research and see if I can build a better mouse trap. And so I took a look at the program. I took a look at what's being offered and what I saw being offered nationally was not what I wanted.

I, you know, I need holistic. I need opportunities. And if you're not very wealthy, you can't afford this over here. No, no, no. This has gotta be for everybody. And so what we did is I came back to Savannah and I spent some time and developed this this concept. And then I went to the local support group in Savannah.

And I said, this is what I've come up with. What do you think? And they took a look at it and they said, well, it concerns us because you're having these people do this and this and this. I said, yeah, yeah, I understand. But let's try it. So we talked to the two groups in Savannah. We had 16 people volunteered to be part of a pilot program that was basically an eight week program.

And twice a week at the end of that eight weeks, we didn't lose anybody. And everybody's level of atheletisism, of health improved dramatically. In fact, the woman that was the lead doctor for the entire group, the neurologic specialist was thrilled about what she saw. She had people that were doing a whole lot better taking less medication.

It was across the board. The local university in Savannah ended up doing field research on it experimental with them with the type of activity we were doing. It's holistic. So it's everything. It's not just centered on one little thing. It's everything. It's it's strength conditioning to build muscle mass, because one of the side effects of the disease, you lose muscle mass, which means you lose bone density.

Bone density, osteoporosis, is a disaster as we get older then we spent the time  doing agility and some time doing flex stretching and some time doing some calisthenics and some floor work. Is it just kettlebells and dumbbells and you name it, hell we use everything I could come up with.

We made it fun. We made it exciting. It's 35, 45 minutes, sometimes an hour. And it is it was a blast to deal was to move. To have a good time to laugh and to more importantly is to socialize. And that program has now exploded in our community. Even during the pandemic, we've done very, very well to keeping that program alive and well.

Okay.

Kevin English: [00:35:39] That's fantastic. And I think I saw maybe it was on your website that you refer to these clients as athletes, not as patients.

Michael Cohen: [00:35:46] Anybody walks in the gym are consider athletes and they're trained as athletes. And I'm going to tell you what, God help us. If we don't yell at them, like a coach yelling at an athlete. If we go in there and we don't yell at these people lovingly. Then they're going to say, you don't like me anymore.

You wouldn't yell at me or push me. No, no, we're going to push you. And it's amazing how many people respond to that? The support group was a little concerned because you know, these are not athletes, Mr. Cohen. And know when they walk in that door, they're now an athlete. They're gonna be treated as an athlete, trained as an athlete.

And that's it. The first one does going up, that's going to kick you in the butt is, is the coach - me. And the first one's going to pat you on the back is also me. So I believe in positive reinforcement all the time, a very up person all the time. But then on the other hand, if you're having that off day, you don't need anybody patronizing you, you don't, you need somebody that's is going to say, look here, we've got to step up.

And so it works out real well. I'm very happy with that.

Kevin English: [00:36:43] Yeah,  that's fantastic. So I I'll make sure that at the end here we tell people where they can go to find out more about that program and I'll drop it into the show notes as well. So let's talk about older athletes here. So let's just say a man or a woman in their sixties. Who's fairly in a de-conditioned state, but it was probably active at some point early in their life.

They come to you  and they want to work with you. But they're a little intimidated about getting started. What do you tell that person?  How do you kind of get that person started?

Michael Cohen: [00:37:14] Believe it or not. It's, it's, it's really, really simple. It's not where you are. Where are you going to be? We all have to start somewhere. My number one athlete in this gym can put over 450 pounds to his chest, all the way over his head. My oldest son. That said he warms up with a piece of PVC pipe that weighs about 30 ounces.

That's it. So he goes from 30 ounces to 450 pounds. It's not where you are, is where you're going to be. The first step is you got here, you made it this far, you got out the house and you made a commitment to come over at least down and talk. So we're going to start very, very light and we're going to move up and no one's going to laugh and no one's going to poke fun at you or none of that kind of stuff, because everybody in his gym everybody's training facility knows that you're starting at ground zero.

No problem. And we don't know what's going to happen, you know, two years from now, you could be the, the 60 year old superstar of weightlifting. I mean, you know, you just don't know. And so that's how we do it. And, and one of my signs that I have my gym that, that we always point to is just that it's not where you are, where you're going to be.

And yep.

Kevin English: [00:38:23] Yeah, that's great. So I, I agree wholeheartedly. The first step is making that commitment right. Stepping in the gym. And that can be very intimidating, especially for an older adult. Right. Walk into a gym there's clanging, and your type of gym going, gonna be clanging banging, probably some yelling going on.

Michael Cohen: [00:38:37] Oh yeah.

Kevin English: [00:38:37] I'd walk into a global gym, might be other things that are intimidating, but certainly making that commitment to walk through the door and say, Hey, I'm ready for change. I love the way you described that as, okay, let's not focus where you are. Let's focus on where you want to be, what you're looking to do.

Yeah. Fantastic. And then you would safely progress them through movement and

Michael Cohen: [00:38:58] Yeah, it's going to go at the pace of the individual. Some people go a lot faster than others, but again, as I tell people, look here. Life is a marathon. It's not a dash. You know, I mean, it's, it's gonna take us a while and I'm there for you. I mean, you know,  the entire coaching staff is there to take you to the next level, to be with you on this journey.

And if the journey is only going to be a couple of steps, then that's that's as far as you want to go. Fantastic. And if you'd see yourself down the road, as, as whatever, our job is to help you achieve that goal, then that's what makes a, a good person. And more importantly, a good coach.

Kevin English: [00:39:35] And do you primarily work with people onsite or do you have a virtual practice as well?

Michael Cohen: [00:39:41] I don't do virtual at all.  My enthusiasm doesn't come out like this. I do go to people's places. I've got a solid group of people that I actually travel around the community that I go a lot of hundred miles outside of the community to work with individuals that want a different quality of life.

But they, they don't want to be around people and then they're too embarrassed or, or whatever the case may be. And so we accommodate that and I am one of the ones that most people would like to see come there. And so you know, it's something about having a, you know, an Olympic coach work with you.

So we accommodate everything that that's just the way it is. I enjoy it. It is something I've done all my life. And now I'm at a point now where I've got some really good solid athletes. I'll put athletes on the Olympic team and at worlds and everything else. And I get as much fun out of working with somebody.  Example I I've got a young man

In his fifties, he just got diagnosed with severe, severe Parkinson's, which is very young. And when he first started working with me to take the lightweight bar, which weighs 10 pounds and put up on the chest, put over his head was next to impossible. I mean, it literally was like pulling teeth.

And so yesterday at the training, he did 110 pounds. And so that's a huge improvement. So you look at where he is and where he, where he was and where he is now, it's night and day difference. And that euphoria of him going, where he hasn't been before and achieving what he never thought would be possible again

is a tremendous high for me. And I get just as much kick out of that as I watch my athletes compete in the Olympics and win the gold medal. Not as much is when my child wins the gold medal, but pretty doggone close.

Kevin English: [00:41:27] Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough. And I think a lot of coaches can relate to that, right? I mean,  most coaches are in it for exactly that. It's the passion for the sport or the training that  that they do. But it's more than that. It's watching your client actually achieve things that they never thought possible is

that you just described it as a high right.

Michael Cohen: [00:41:48] I tell people I do about 120 clinics a year all over the country, weightlifting clinics. And I tell them all the individuals who sign up for these things. I tell them all the time, look here I am 63. I lifted some huge weights when I was younger. I'll never lift those weights again, ever, ever. Some of those weights, I don't even want to think about because my knees hurt

just thinking about, so the euphoria of me going where I have not been in a weightlifting situation will never happen. I'll never get to that level again. I'll never lift those kinds of weights again. And so I live vicariously through the accomplishments of my athletes. When I sent an athlete out there to break a record and win the metal.

I remember that feeling. I remember that high. If, if I've got an individual that's in the gym that this all of a sudden putting over, say 110 pounds, when it used to be 10 pounds, I understand that, that he will live that moment for, for several hours that day. He may sleep about it, think about it the next night.

And so I understand that and I miss that. And only way I could get my hands back on that again, relive it to other people.

Kevin English: [00:42:51] Yeah, living it vicariously through your athletes. Yeah, absolutely. Now do a lot of your elite athletes. Do they travel there to train?

Michael Cohen: [00:42:58] Oh, yeah. People that I have people that travel to Savannah and train people all over the country that actually work with, I do a lot of remote programming where I write the program for them. Totally different than a lot of people. To me, it's a passion. I don't do it computer generated and one size fits all.

Everybody's different and it's a lot of fun, very time consuming. But it is, it is a lot of fun. Most of my people that I work with remotely around the country, I actually see when I travel around the country, I'll let them know that I'm going to be, Hey, I'm going to be in, in Brownsville, Texas. And, and you know, if you're within a couple of hundred miles, please stop by.

I'll be glad to work with you for free. So you got a community of people that you like. Of course, I got my athletes here in Savannah. But we have a little bit of everything and it it's me. It's, it's a blast. I enjoy keeping the balls in the air. I enjoy, you know, getting up in the morning, go and see the guy that's in the seventies, thet's just had a stroke and work with him and then turn right around and come to the gym and work with a guy who is trying to train for the 2024 games, you know, and, and turn around and go work with this gentleman over here.

I mean, it's you bouncing back and forth, all kinds of different levels. I enjoy that.

Kevin English: [00:44:07] Yeah, that you do have quite a wide variety of. I mean, most coaches don't get to coach Olympic level athletes, right. Or super elite athletes. So that's one thing. That's the pointy end of the stick, but you're also not just in the general population, but out into the special populations as well.

Some of these, like you said, the older people, the folks that work with, and your get excited and move program, you had mentioned doing seminars and whatnot. And I, one thing I wanted to run by you, or just kind of get your thoughts on is CrossFit. I know CrossFit has put a lot of barbells into a lot of adults, specifically older adults hands,  and it's taught them to Olympic lift,

Michael Cohen: [00:44:43] okay. CrossFit has done more for USA weightlifting than anything else at all. 25 years ago, United States weightlifting might've had 3000 registered athletes in the whole entire country. Now we're in the 35, 40,000 range. Why? CrossFit. You know, you walk down the street anywhere in the country with a little barbell on your shirt and the first thing person who asks you is how much can you bench press see?

I don't get that anymore. And that's because CrossFit doesn't do a whole lot of benches. They do the Olympic movements. So it's amazing. I just came back on a five day tour of Texas. And in that process, I had to stop and get gas all over the place. And it's amazing how many times I walk in to get something at that little convenience thing there and the person working, it says, Hey, you do Olympic weight lifting?

Yeah. I'll do Olympic weightlifting and that's changed now. There's no more question about how much you can bench for us. You know, what's your best clean and jerk? Do you work with this athlete? CrossFit has done that. They've done that. My sport has not done that at all, but we've got the residual of CrossFit.

So CrossFit has done amazing things for United States. And then of course, and for me, I would say 90% of the places that I go to around the country that I do my clinics and coaching courses and whatnot are CrossFit boxes. And I would say of those 90%, 80% are repeat. I've gone to, you know, three, four, five, six, seven times in the last eight years.

So it's a blast. I enjoy that. I work with another group of athletes. I get, you know, four hours to beat the mess out of them and have a good time and laugh and joke and teach them something

Kevin English: [00:46:18] Yeah. Okay.  I thought you might answer that way. CrossFit certainly has  made those movements a little more  accessible and kind of populatized them. I mean, that has to flow out. Now I do CrossFit myself and I know there's a certain number of people that are going to come in,

they're going to fall in love with that weightlifting piece. And they're going to, they're going to leave CrossFit and they're going to go find specialized training.

Michael Cohen: [00:46:36] And I would say , the five boxes that I visited this past week, four them have asked me to help them develop olympic weight lifting classes, what they call Oly classes, just for Olympic weight lifting, because their members are starting to move towards that part of it, because it is a lot of fun.

And so they get to compete against people their own age. So you don't have a 37 year old tying to compete against a 21 year old. It doesn't work that way. And then in the same hand, a 60 year old is not going to compete against a 37 year old.

And there's sports specific for men and women, 10 weight classes for every age group. So you're talking about all the way up to infinity. I mean, my father competes in the 85 to 89 year old division. And so there is something there for everybody. And so you're seeing more and more CrossFit boxes go lean towards incorporating the Olympic lifting as a, as a program itself to provide more opportunities for their clients.

Kevin English: [00:47:29] And that's been my experience as well. I, I had never done Olympic lifting until I was in my mid fifties. And of course I, I had heard somewhere in men's magazine or on some other show somewhere that that's dangerous. Why would you do that? You certainly wouldn't want to do clean and jerks or snatches for time, et cetera, et cetera.

But that was not my experience. Our coaches were very methodical and very good about training. Like you said, we had all the classes. So, you know, every Saturday we had this an Olympic lifting specialist come in and really work on technique. And it was one of the more popular classes we did.

People really wanted to learn.

Michael Cohen: [00:48:03] Sure. Sure. I am a lead instructor for United States, weightlifting teaching the Olympic classes, the coaching classes level one, level two for the United States. And one of the things that we do, we push and we have documented information and data to back it up is it's an incredibly safe sport.

There're very few injuries, serious injuries in our sport. I mean, it's something that you can do a long time, a long time, and it's not going to destroy you. It is a fast explosive movement. So you get that speed. You get that generator power, and that's it. It is easy to teach p you teach age specific and.

Level specific. So it makes our job very easy because we have a set criteria of teaching you the limit movements, what they call little ballistic movements and a step by step by step by step. And if you follow that projection, then you're going to be a very safe coach, and a safe athlete.

Kevin English: [00:48:57] Yeah. So I just want to make sure everybody out there heard that. What you're saying is that Olympic lifting is safe and it's, and you can do it Right? Pretty, more or less. I don't know about forever, but certainly

Michael Cohen: [00:49:10] yeah. Example again, in our coaching courses, we mentioned this, when you talk about safety in sports is very, very difficult. All sports have a certain level of chance of difficulty doing. If you're going to reach a certain level, it's going to be difficult. But then on the other hand, you can twist an ankle walking outside.

So weightlifting is considered one of the least injury prone, sports.

Kevin English: [00:49:32] Fantastic. Yeah, love it. All right. Well, Mike as we're wrapping up here. You've accomplished so much in your lifetime, right? Between your work as an athlete, and then as a coach. Now what's next for you?

Michael Cohen: [00:49:44] Believe it or not. I am the organizing committee director for the 2021 national master championships in Orlando. So I'll serve as the director of operations there for that. They'll also hosts the 2021 Pan-American championships. That will be also in the same venue in all of this. So I've got my hands full there.

I am the coordinator for the 2022 world championships. There'll be held in the United States first time since 2003. So I got my hands set there. I usually schedule between a 100 and 125 clinics nationally. I said, used to say globally, but the last 10 months there is no global in there. It's all local.

So I travel, my wife books these things up, usually three to six months in advance. Most of them are sold out. That that is something I truly enjoy. I am a college professor but this is my last semester, so I can spend more time doing the other things that I love. So I've got my hands full.

My oldest boy is in hard training. He looks really good. I think he's going to be ready for the nationals this year in June. 20, 20, 21 Olympics is not in the cards for him. That's that's past. So to get the deal now is to get him ready for 2024, which will be in Paris. So that's the next long-term project for us and my wife's a national champion and world record holder.

So basically to keep her going in the same position, but more importantly is to keep myself strong enough so I can defend myself against her.

Kevin English: [00:51:11] Is that right? Okay. Fair enough. Yeah, that's, that's quite an active family. You've obviously got a lot going on. So if people want to connect with you, what's the best way for them to get in touch with you.

Michael Cohen: [00:51:21] Michael Cohen, Olympic weight lifting on Facebook. That's probably the best way you can message me there. We have a website  and you can email me at Cohen, weightlifting.com as well. So I mean, it it's the best way to get in touch with me. People here locally always call me basically because I'm always at the gym or whatnot, but Facebook messenger is probably the best bet.

Again, that's Michael Cohen, Olympic weightlifting and you know, a lot of videos there are a lot of things going on. You can certainly scroll, look at the events that I'm going to, places that I'm going. I have a lot of people that go to those events  that one watch and, and perhaps participate in after they watch it for a while and, and whatnot.

So.

Kevin English: [00:52:01] all right. And I'll make sure I get all that dropped into the show notes as well so  people can contact you there. So, Michael, I just want to thank you so much for coming on the show, sharing all of your stories, your wisdom with us. You're a great ambassador for healthy aging. You really are, and I wish you all the best in all your future endeavors.

Michael Cohen: [00:52:18] Appreciate. Thank you very much for having I, and I look forward to talking to you again.